MAC Forum

Hey all,

Here is my first of my "Airplane Ashtray" collection, an Allyn Sales P-51. It was found like most without canopy or prop blades. After conferring with Steve Remmington at Collectair, I made my own. The canopy shown is the MK1 mule. I will use it to build more but with a slightly lower profile. The prop blades are resin units that are modified to match each stub and are "cuffed" like the prototype's. The tips are awaiting a touch of yellow. I am blessed with two more of these ashtrays in the same condition and am now looking for one more.. leads are welcome.

Regards, Tom

Tom, nice P 51 . I remember there was a collector in CA who had the canopies and pilots recast from originals for these models. I will try to dig up his phone number for you but the papers are in storage and it may take a week or so. Regards,Larry

Larry,

Anything you can dig up would be great!

Thanks,
Tom Sanders

I'd be interested in a good clean replacement prop for mine as well. I cast this epoxy prop from what was left of one blade and the original spinner. Looks goofy but better than nuthin! Might help if I painted it.



That's the original spinner and one blade in the ashtray. I tried making an impression in clay to cast the prop out of lead/zinc but I couldn't get the thinckness right.



Cheers,

Ladd

Ladd,

Did you attempt to remove the propeller remnants originally? I had asked around before addressing mine and was told by a couple of restorers that there was no equitable way of removing the prop as the "one way" propshaft/ pin would snap off into the airplane's cavity. Since the original blades were broken off with stubs remaining, I opted for the resin route. At least now the plades have a better, paddle blade profile and the bonus was that the baldes are not sharp at the tips and even flex. The running gag is that the waiters would snap off the blades after binging scratched adnauseum while dumping the slippery ashtrays.

Please take some side pics of your canopy and post them. I am updating my design and want to consider the original's profile.

Regards,
Tom Sanders

Try these shots. I can't get to the P-51 easily so I have to shoot it through glass. Hope one of these helps.





The prop on mine was already removed by the guy I bought it from. I hadn't even thought about it for years until you brought up this subject. Now I'll probably have to do something about it.

Cheers,

Ladd

Ladd,
Great Shots, thanks!
Tom

Ladd,
Here's a shot of the solid plexi canopy I made for another P-80 owner.
Regards,
Tom sanders

Ladd,
I measured the prop hub from the resin 1/48 kit and its very close to the Allyn hub. Possibly using their hub to replace your metal cast hub might work. Here are your possible options....

1) Leave basically alone although grinding some off the blades at the spinner's junction might help appearance wise.
2) Use the old hub and modify it. Here's how I would do it...
a) measure the inside diam. (ID) hole left in the nose
b) go to the hardware store or McMaster-Carr and see if a "Pop-Rivet" would fit the ID or is slightly big.
c) If one is found, bore out the hub slightly undersized to match the actual rivet pin (not the flanged tube).
d) reverse the rivet pin so that the pin is in backwards. The knob of the pin is against the narrow opening of the rivet
e) whatever depth you bored out on the hub shaft hole, trim the pin to match or be a millimeter long.
f) wipe pin down with alcohol and cover about a third of the pin with a slow cure epoxy mix.
g) slide the hub into place. Let cure for two days. Besure not to get Epoxy in side the new "bearing".
h) trial fit that it goes into the nose's new shaft hole. Adhere if fairly tight with glue stick, no kidding.
If you ever want to exchange it, just lossen the bond with rubbing alcohol.
Replacing the blades on the old hub.... There are some mold methods that can create those same blades on metal but... the blade profile is wrong and they are very brittle. I use an ULTRACAST 1/48 P-51Hamilition Standard Cuffless assembly and it's worked out well. I just took some time to workout a pitch gauge, Dremeled and filed each blade to fit the stub and used 5-minute epoxy. Took a Saturday afternoon to do.

3) Last would be to convert totally to the resin Hub and Blades to replace the Prop Assembly using the method above to create a prop shaft.

4) Find and original unit?

The info fot the resin assembly is below...
Ultracast Ph 513-823-0181 www.ultracast.ca
PO Box 31025
Guelph, ON, CA
N1H 8K1

PRT# 48137, P-51 Mustang Hamilton-Std Cufless 4-Blade Prop and Spinner $10.95 ea.

Good Luck,
Tom Sanders

SUper ideas, Tom. Now I'll just have to put it on my "to do" list. I'll book mark that website as well. Very helpful.

As long as you are sharing your secrets tell me what your methodology was for making P-80 canopy? I have a basket case Topping F-105 that needs a canopy. As far as I know it is a simple canopy with no scribe or moulded lines. I'd just like to get it clear and shiny.

Cheers,

Ladd